Cycling & Sweating Sue: Two Decades Outriding Metastatic Breast Cancer 

Robert Pease (co-host)

In 2013, Sue came down with a cough that she just could not get rid of. 

Sue

So I thought maybe it was allergies. And it was summer, and fall was coming, and could it be maybe, you know, the tree pollen, whatever. And so I called my amazing nurse practitioner, Jenn McKenna.

Jenn McKenna, NP

She called me and she said, “it’s been a while now, but this cough has not gone away”.

Sue

And she said, just take some Claritin and do the inhaler if it’s troubled breathing. And I said, okay. If it doesn’t go away in a week, call me. But it didn’t go away. 

Jenn

And I said, okay, let’s, let’s get you set up for scans.

Robert Pease (co-host)

Sue went into the lab at Dana Farber. She had been treated there a decade earlier for breast cancer, but had been in remission ever since.

Sue

And so then she said, you know, we have to do scans ’cause you just don’t know. And just, you know, I know, it’s the conversation of could it be something, right?

Robert Pease (co-host)

Sue had the CAT scans and went home. Back at Dana-Farber, Jenn looked over the imaging. 

Jenn McKenna, NP

And I didn’t need a radiologist to tell me what was happening. You know, I could just see all these big, kind of fluffy white balls in all of her lung fields. 

Robert Pease (co-host)

Sue was at home in the kitchen when the phone rang. It was Jenn. 

Sue

She called to say I had tumors all over my lungs.

Jenn McKenna, NP

There was a lot of cancer in her lungs, and it was remarkable that she had just two months prior ridden in the PMC. 

Robert Pease (co-host)

The PMC, or Pan Mass Challenge, is an annual 200-mile bike ride across Massachusetts to raise money for cancer research at Dana Farber.

Jenn McKenna, NP

I mean, I just couldn’t believe it based on what I saw. 

Robert Pease (co-host)

This is My Body Odyssey, a show about the rewards and challenges of an active lifestyle. I’m Robert Pease. Today is the third episode in our mini-series on cycling and cancer. Last time we heard from Generational Gene, trying to ward off cancer, who finished the 200-mile Pan Mass Challenge for the fifth time this year. 

Gene

Some days, you know, it feels like you pedal to save your life and, in a lot of ways, at these events, you really are. 

Robert Pease (co-host)

Today’s episode is about another PMC cyclist: Sue Spencer, whose commitment to the PMC is even more substantial.   

Sue

This will be my 20th year of riding the Pan Mass Challenge.

Robert Pease (co-host)

But what’s even more remarkable is that for ten of those years, Sue has been riding with metastatic breast cancer. 

Robert Pease (co-host)

This story comes from our producer Debbie Blicher. Hey Debbie. 

Debbie Blicher (co-host)

Hi, Rob.

Robert Pease (co-host)

Debbie’s joining me today to dive into Sue’s odyssey of cancer and cycling. But before we do that, we wanted to draw your attention to something unique and special about this particular episode. 

Debbie Blicher (co-host)

Yeah. On My Body Odyssey, usually we bring in outside medical experts for their comments and insights. We introduce our protagonist stories to them, so they’re hearing all of this for the first time. But for this episode, Sue introduced us to her medical team.

Robert Pease (co-host)

Yeah, so big thanks to Sue for being so open and willing to share her story and for making these introductions. And thanks to these oncologists for speaking with us. And let’s get right into that story. 

Sue

So when I got my first bike, I’ll, I’m gonna guess I was around five, and I loved it. And I will proudly say, I didn’t need training wheels. I was a good balancer.

Robert Pease (co-host)

By age ten, Sue was taking bikes apart and putting them back together. And at that age, bikes are about so much more than just transportation. 

Sue 

I bought a 10 speed and just rode all around and just loved it. It’s such freedom to ride.

Debbie Blicher (co-host)
Sue kept riding as she grew up, and through college, and through her first jobs  

Robert Pease (co-host) 

When she got hired to run a lab at Children’s Hospital in Boston, Sue biked the ten miles to work every day. 

Sue

That’s a podcast for another day because life in the virology lab was awesome.

Robert Pease (co-host) 

But then… her life changed in 2003.  

Sue

Um, I had noticed a lump. And at 40 then, it was the time to do a mammogram. So we did the mammogram and, you know, it was cancerous. 

Debbie Blicher (co-host)

She had no family history of breast cancer, and it’s rare to get it so young. People under 40 make up just a tiny fraction of all breast cancer cases. 

Robert Pease (co-host) 

So this really came out of nowhere for Sue. And her doctors were saying they needed to act fast. 

Sue

You know, this is serious. You know, it was stage three B. So it was in my lymph nodes.

Robert Pease (co-host) 

So much new information coming at her, so much to process, and so many decisions needed to be made.

Sue

So you are like taking whatever is being put in front of you and processing, is this the right team? You know, what do I need to do? 

Debbie Blicher (co-host)

Sue felt pretty lost at first. But she felt she was in good hands when she met her oncologist, Dr. Ernst.

Sue

He said my cancer was aggressive and he wasn’t gonna, you know, lie about that. But his goal was to make me an old lady. I just felt as though he was a person I could trust with my life.

Robert Pease (co-host) 

Dr. Ernst and the team, they guided Sue through a long and demanding series of treatments. Chemo, antibody treatments, surgery. Then more chemo and radiation.   

Sue

So it was, it was pretty, you know, rigorous and uh, intense. 

Robert Pease (co-host) 

Despite that rigor and intensity, Sue made it a point to get to know the whole staff. And they got to know her. And she noticed when a new NP, named Jenn McKenna, joined the team. 

Jenn McKenna, NP

You know, like she was all in, you know, welcoming me to Dana Farber. And so I just really liked her right away.

Debbie Blicher (co-host)

After 8 months of treatment, Sue was cancer-free.

Sue

They just took such great care of me. I said, “I just don’t know how I would ever repay all of you for what you’ve done”.

Robert Pease (co-host) 

One of Sue’s doctors told her exactly how she could repay them. 

Sue

And she said, “Oh, you can ride the Pan-Mass Challenge”. And, and it’s strange growing up -or not growing up, but living here for many years- I had never heard of it. So I said, “Okay”. 

Debbie Blicher (co-host)

The Pan-Mass Challenge raises money for cancer research. In the 40+ years the PMC has been around, it’s raised almost a billion dollars for Dana Farber. 

Robert Pease (co-host) 

It’s no surprise that many of the riders are cancer survivors, or family members. People who have lost loved ones to cancer. But there’s also a lot of riders who are medical professionals in the field: clinicians, researchers, people at the forefront of trying to cure cancer. 

Dr. Eric Winer

And I rode in it initially in 1998, and then participated in it for a total of 22 years. 

Debbie Blicher (co-host)

Dr. Eric Winer is president of the Smilow Cancer Hospital at Yale. He’s one of Sue’s former oncologists. And one of many doctors at Dana Farber riding the PMC. 

Dr. Eric Winer

We formed a team that we initially called WOW: Women’s Oncology on Wheels. 

Robert Pease (co-host) 

Dr. Winer invited Sue to ride with them on team WOW. And Sue accepted. There was just one small problem…

Sue

I was more than glad to give it a whirl, but I hadn’t ridden a bike in years, so that was the, uh, and I didn’t have a bike…so…

Debbie Blicher (co-host)

At this point, it’s three months until the PMC. So, Sue needed to start training.

Debbie Blicher (co-host)

So you said “Okay I’ll do it” but you didn’t even own a bike.

Sue

Correct.

Robert Pease (co-host) 

She went to her local bike store and walked up to the bike guy. 

Sue

I said let’s get a road bike, and nothing, you know, outrageously expensive. And, uh, I even said, maybe not even a road bike. And he said, “Oh, you can ride -you’re not 90 years old, you can ride a rolled handlebar bike”. I said “Okay great”. 

Debbie Blicher (co-host)

Sue brought home the new bike, started her training rides. And those training rides were long. And that’s when reality set in. She had a moment of like: “Wait, what did I agree to? 

Sue

And I said, I don’t know if I can do this. You know, uh, I just finished all this treatment. 

Robert Pease (co-host) 

She confided some of that concern to a coworker, someone who had ridden the PMC.  

Sue

And he said, “It’s a ride, not a race”. 

Robert Pease (co-host) 

Sue’s colleague made that important distinction there between cycling races and rides, like this one. There’s no competition, no one watching times very closely, and lots of snacks.  

Debbie Blicher (co-host)

The pep talk was a game changer for Sue. And it allowed her to take a deep breath and enjoy the process.  

Sue

For me, it’s just being, you know, so grateful for how blessed I am. And realizing that my ability to ride is, it’s a gift.

Debbie Blicher (co-host)

On a hot morning in August, Sue got on her bike and rode to the start of the Pan Mass Challenge. 

Sue

When you arrive, there are thousands of people and everyone wears that year’s PMC jersey. 

Robert Pease (co-host) 

A sea of cyclists, all wearing that same shirt, and all preparing to ride hundreds of miles for the cause. 

Sue

It was emotional, you know, to be there and to say that I was gonna do this. And I’ll not lie, it was a hot and hard day to ride. 

Robert Pease (co-host) 

It’s early morning–the sun still low in the sky, but it’s already apparent: it’s going to be ungodly hot out there.  

Sue

A woman who I didn’t know just kind of, you know, bent over and said, “Oh my gosh, you’re really sweaty”. And we haven’t even started riding yet. 

Robert Pease (co-host) 

A bit of pre-ride anxiety there. Remember, it is Sue’s first Pan Mass Challenge. And then the riders lined up for the start of the ride while the national anthem played over the loudspeaker. 

Sue

Then they start playing, U2 “It’s A Beautiful Day”. And it really does sum up, you know, it’s a beautiful day. Here I am, I’m riding the Pan Mass Challenge.

Debbie Blicher (co-host)

And it was a beautiful day. But also, way hotter than Sue expected. 

Sue

You know, never riding it, I never realized that the first week in August is usually very, very, very hot. And I don’t think I had fully grasped the water, the Gatorade, staying hydrated. You know, I was fine, but I became better at my hydration breakout.  

Robert Pease (co-host) 

Sue got more and more dehydrated over the course of the day, out in the scorching sun. But she toughed it out, determined to finish. 

Sue

Also I had just been through probably six months of chemotherapy and radiation therapy. 

Debbie Blicher (co-host)

Not many people would be up to this challenge. But Sue says she was able to do it because she stayed active–even during the tough periods of her treatment.

Sue

For me, part of the feeling, that I had control of this was being active. So, walking every day to the mailbox, you know, a mile away in town to bring my thank you notes was what I would do.

Robert Pease (co-host) 

Despite the heat, the long course of treatment, and not even owning a bike a few months ago, Sue did finish her first Pan Mass Challenge. 

Sue

So if I look back and say, “Wow, I rode, you know, 80 some miles on day one”, that’s pretty good. But it was hard. I would be lying if I said it wasn’t. 

Debbie Blicher (co-host)

The following year, Sue showed up to the starting line of the PMC again. And then again the next year, and the next 10 years. And all that time, she’s cancer-free.  

Robert Pease (co-host) 

And that brings us right up to the moment she finished the ride in 2013 and came down with a mysterious cough, the one we heard about earlier. 

Debbie Blicher (co-host)

After getting the news about the tumors on her lungs, Sue went in to see her doctors. 

Sue 

And so I went in the next day. Some friends came with me, which was great, because that’s something too, again, you don’t wanna sit there by yourself and listen to all this.

Robert Pease (co-host) 

Originally, Sue’s diagnosis was breast cancer. But now the cancer was in her lungs. That meant it was metastatic. 

Dr. Rachel Freedman

Metastatic disease is when breast cancer has spread to a different part of one’s body or what we call a distant spread typically. 

Debbie Blicher (co-host)

Dr. Rachel Freedman is Sue’s current oncologist at Dana Farber. 

Dr. Rachel Freedman

People can live years with metastatic breast cancer. There’s so many treatments available, there’s more every year. And the idea when somebody has breast cancer that needs to be managed more like a chronic condition, is to have people live with their breast cancer, right? And that is the goal, to have them live the best life and have the best quality they can have. But usually, it is with some form of treatment going on in the background of that, that is ongoing. 

Debbie Blicher (co-host)

This time, Sue’s treatment lasted six months. She had to get chemo once a week, plus get doses of two monoclonal antibodies. 

Sue

You know, it was harsh. And again, I say that my keeping active is part of the ability to do that weekly. 

Robert Pease (co-host) 

Despite having to go in every week for such a long period, Sue found the side effects a bit more manageable this time. 

Sue

I lost my hair again, you know, round two. As my friends say, I’m lucky I have a nicely shaped head, which I do. 

Robert Pease (co-host) 

Soon the persistent cough got a little better. Sue got re-scanned, and this time, they saw the tumors shrinking. 

Debbie Blicher (co-host)

She felt relieved, but she knew she wasn’t fully in the clear. 

Sue

The challenging piece for metastatic breast cancer, and another reason I ride, is there isn’t one treatment to say you’re cured. So you live with the disease. It’s chronic.  

Robert Pease (co-host) 

Ever since that phone call when she learned about the tumors on her lungs, she sees Jenn McKenna and her oncology team once a month to try and stay ahead of this. 

Jenn McKenna, NP

That began the journey of me seeing Sue, essentially at least, every three weeks for the last 10 years. 

Sue

I get any number of treatments over these 10 years. There’ve probably been, I don’t know, six or seven different versions of treatment.

Robert Pease (co-host) 

And through all of that, Sue stayed very active. Whether it’s delivering thank you notes, playing pickleball, or riding the Pan Mass Challenge every single year. She is doing remarkably well. 

Debbie Blicher (co-host) 

I am curious about what you can tell me about the interaction of exercise and breast cancer or cancer in general?

Dr. Eric Winer

Well I wish I could tell you more. It goes without saying that, nobody is going to argue that exercise is bad for you. 

Debbie Blicher (co-host) 

Dr. Winer is one of Sue’s former oncologists–we met him earlier. 

Dr. Eric Winer

Although I tell my patients that if they can get exercise, that’s a great thing,I’m not prescribing it the way I would prescribe a drug. 

Robert Pease (co-host) 

Dr. Winer is a highly experienced clinical oncologist. Of course, he’s careful about suggesting that exercise can cure cancer or anything like that. But he does say that the benefits of exercise for general health and well-being…those are quite clear. 

Dr. Eric Winer 

I think that a physically active lifestyle, however you wanna pursue that, is something that, in general, makes people happier, makes people more productive. 

Debbie Blicher (co-host) 

Sue’s nurse practitioner, Jenn McKenna, feels that exercise is really valuable for successful treatment.

Jenn McKenna, NP

It can really help them tolerate everything better, including the difficulty with uncertainty around cancer. Is my cancer gonna come back, or is my cancer gonna respond? You know, how long am I going to live? Exercise is a really important tool that we can use to help people with their mental health.

Robert Pease (co-host) 

Jenn and Sue are in complete agreement about this–exercise, mental health resilience. Over the years, they’ve started to keep each other motivated.

Jenn McKenna, NP

Sue and I are Peloton friends, and we do rides together sometimes.

Debbie Blicher (co-host) 

I don’t think I knew that you were a cyclist. Um, that’s, that’s fantastic. 

Jenn McKenna, NP

Well, I will clarify, I am not. I am only a Peloton-ist. I am not a cyclist. So I I’m not out on the road much at all, much to Sue’s disappointment. And she has tried to convince me to ride in the PMC, frequently, for the past 15 years. 

Robert Pease (co-host) 

Sue completed the PMC for the 20th time this year. It wasn’t nearly as hot this time, and at this point, she hydrates like a pro.  

Debbie Blicher (co-host) 

She still remembers what that woman said to her at the starting line, when Sue was sweating so much.  But now she’s kinda proud of it.

Sue

I’m super sweaty.I usually try to strive for the sweatiest person of the PMC award.

Debbie Blicher (co-host) 

This year, Sue rode with the same team she’s ridden with since 2004; the one her oncologists invited her to join. Although, over the past 20 years, it’s gotten a lot bigger.

Sue

We were this weekend, 95 people, which is really amazing. Because I think we’re on track to raise $800,000 for the Dana this year.

Debbie Blicher (co-host) 

Sue shows up every year for this ride- to raise money, to help the cause. And she also shows up for the community she’s found through the ride. These people get what she’s going through. 

Jenn McKenna, NP

You know, I mean I think she really leads by example. You know, she’s always thinking about other people and what will make them happy. She doesn’t spend, you know, any time feeling sorry for herself. “Why me?” None of that. She just keeps living her life, you know, doing all the things that make her happy in a way that we all should. You know, we can learn from that.

Robert Pease (co-host) 

Sue plans to ride the PMC for as long as she can. Especially for the members of that community who are no longer with her. 

Sue

You know, I struggle, you know, with survivor’s guilt. I’ve had many friends who I’ve met through this journey, right? And, um, you know, they aren’t here. And so I need to do something. I need to keep giving back. I also know that they would say, “Just keep pedaling. What are you crazy?” So they’re still my champions.

Robert Pease (co-host) 

That’s our protagonist this episode, Cycling Sue: Metastatic breast cancer survivor and avid PMC rider, who leaves it all out there on these rides, some of it in small puddles. 

Debbie Blicher (co-host)

I have to ask, how did you do on the sweatiest person award? 

Sue

I, I- Good question. I, I’ve crowned myself such, as sweatiest person again.

Debbie Blicher (co-host)

Hoorah. 

Sue

I feel good about it. Exactly.

Debbie Blicher (co-host)

Fabulous. 

Robert Pease (co-host) 

Many thanks to Cycling Sue for sharing her odyssey and allowing us to speak with her oncology team, both present and past. And huge thanks also to doctors Winer and Freedman and Nurse Practitioner Jenn McKenna for educating us on the challenge of metastatic cancer.

Robert Pease (co-host) 

Next time on My Body Odyssey, we’re going to put the bikes down and put wet suits on to swim along with Open Water Annie- if we can keep up with her. Annie swims at a very high level, but with no interest in competing. Instead, her swimming is motivated by what a half hour in open water can do for the anxious mind. 

Annie 

The science tells us when we’re injured and we’re in a hospital bed and we can see a tree out the window, that helps aid our healing. And being here, swimming here versus in a pool, helps my healing, you know, and helps me, um, keep myself, I, I guess as, uh, as calm. And that’s not an easy thing in our, in our society, in our culture.

Robert Pease (co-host) 

Please join us oceanside for that interview with Annie and some experts insights on the many benefits of open water swimming for PTSD, other anxiety disorders, really for anyone -which is essentially everyone- who struggles with stress management. 

Robert Pease (co-host) 

My Body Odyssey is a Fluent Knowledge production. Original music by Ryan Adair Rooney.